gender difference

[miriam_e]

I've been trying to distract myself while waiting for the phone to ring with news of Mali.

I got to thinking about claims of difference between the minds of women and men. In the past I've witnessed hot arguments on the subject, with both sides generally insisting more or less the same thing -- that men and women think and feel differently. I'd always been uncomfortable with such arguments as nobody ever gives any evidence; they argue entirely from their own experience, with one saying to the other that "You can never know what it feels to be [insert male or female here] because you are not." It was always a confounding statement to make, because they're right, nobody can know what maleness or femaleness feels like if they are not of that gender. However I always found it unsettling because I never felt a part of my gender, so I'd always felt a little mystified at what they meant.

It suddenly hit me today that the entire argument springs from a delusion. When people assume that what they feel is shared by others of their gender, they are making an unfounded assumption. They say people of their own gender feel a particular way, and that those of the other gender don't, but how can they possibly know if either of those statements is true? Clearly they can't. Neither sex has access to telepathy. Nobody knows what another human being feels like, let alone an entire gender of humans. And the simple fact that I stand alone, feeling not particularly female or male would tend to disprove it anyway. If I feel like this, how many others do?

I've met plenty of strong, aggressive, gadget-oriented women, and gentle, touchy-feely males. It looks to me that there is far more overlap between the sexes than there are distinguishing features, meaning that many, many people (most?) are not able to be easily fitted into any simplified box of shared experience or mental traits.

Despite it being one of those commonly accepted "self-evident truths", it seems it is really just another example of sexism.

Comments

[dorjejaguar.livejournal.com]

The maths are not my strong point, but I do think I get it when you talk about the statistics. All I have to do is remember how an average is made, one can add in two instances that are at the far ends of the scale and come up with an "average" that represents neither and no one.
Least I think that's how it can work if I'm understanding that correctly.

I think for me I recognize something more like masculine, feminine and androgynous tendencies or energy. These aren't necessarily tied to sex. And they're not predictors as much as descriptives. Beyond that they aren't at all mutually exclusive, in fact live entwined in myriads of beautiful individual ways. When I talk about this it's more like I'm talking about the Tao or something, it's not about what men and women are, only a description of how people can express.

I have this one friend whom is transsexual. She told me once that the ancient Egyptians (I think it was) recognized some large number of genders. Like somewhere in the range of 15 if I remember correctly.
I've no idea if this is so but it could be so. We don't have to be so limited in our understanding of gender.

I know myself I feel pretty "female", however I often do stuff that people don't expect out of women. Honestly it pisses me off a bit when people characterize some of that behaivor and choices as masculine, perhaps cause it seems to me to reveal some limitation on what they're thinking can be female behaivor or limitation on femininity.
That's just my personal thing though, really people are gonna see me and everyone the way they're gonna. I can't stop that.
It also pains me to see the cultural boxes provided for men. It's so gotta suck for them, those boxes are too damn small.
My last job had me working in the most culturally "masculine" environment I'd ever been in and all the negative stuff about that cultural reinforcement was incredibly glaring to me. It just seemed so very painful.

The assumption challenging, you're right, given that it's where we start from they can be hard to question. Only a couple years ago I realized that I was still making assumptions about how and what men feel or even can feel. Shocked me when I stumbled across that. I wanted to share this insight but felt it would be almost impossible to do so.

You're welcome for the Ted talk. :)
There's also another movie that I watched a while back that I feel is very valuable. It's called Tough Guise: Violence, Media and the Crisis in Masculinity.
In some ways it's hard for me to watch but it is revealing. I'm really hope men, boys and everyone can see something like it that examines and questions the roles for men that have been culturally dictated. Changing those views can change this earth and our experience of it, I've no doubt of that.

[miriam-e.livejournal.com]

I agree totally with everything in your reply. I especially like your statement about "descriptions not predictors"; that was lovely.

I remember seeing a diagram in an article in Scientific American years (decades) ago about sexuality. It showed gender to be a continuous spectrum, and tore up the misconception that there are just poles with only rare perversity in between. I really wish humanity could get used to and enjoy the idea of diversity. It would be so much more healthy than this idea of purity that generally brings such dysfunction and illness.

I worry about males today. In a weird way they have become their own worst enemies. Expectations placed upon them by others and themselves are conflicting with good sense. As a result, young males particularly, are suiciding in horrifying numbers, especially here in Australia. Women have seen their expectations loosen up while men have, as you say, seen their cultural boxes become smaller.

I'll keep my eye out for that movie too. Thanks.

[dorjejaguar.livejournal.com]

I think that movie is available online. I've found it by googling before. I believe it was created as someone's thesis.

I remember seeing the Kinsey scale that kinda does the same thing for sexual orientation when I was 18. That shifted my perception in a positive way too. It's hard to even explain how or why. I was already aware I was bisexual (and now I'm not keen on that word cause it implies only two genders or sexes, but at least people know what I mean when I say it). I was okay with being bi too already. I guess it helped just to see my way as being part of a spectrum. It feels a bit cozier to think of it that way. :)

I know that there are a great many people who are happy about difference. I know these people and this is how I know. So I have hope. :)
And its true that many have more trouble with it but really life gets boring and painful if one tries to shut out all difference. It takes it's toll. Life does have a way of challenging our perceptions. So that's cool.
I worry about the men too. I do see change though and I really want for my part to try and be kind, not accommodating to what ails them but kind.
I do have hope. Which is good. :)